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Author Topic: SR22 Crash at MLB  (Read 14584 times)
Dubbie
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« on: February 29, 2012, 09:33:53 PM »

[Edited link out since archives expire in 45 days]

http://www.floridatoday.com/article/20120229/NEWS01/120229025/Two-killed-in-Melbourne-plane-crash

Rip Sad
« Last Edit: March 01, 2012, 09:48:13 AM by dave » Logged
dave
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« Reply #1 on: February 29, 2012, 10:08:47 PM »

Attached is a recording that covers the time from the pattern activity and the Cirrus pilot checking in with Melbourne Tower until after the crash.

I believe the partial tail number is N5x4SR - possibly N504SR or N514SR.  I got notified about this crash earlier and reviewed these tapes...sounds like there were 2-3 pilot witnesses as well as Melbourne Tower.  Sounds like the crash happened as '4SR (the Cirrus) was cutting it in tight for Runway 9R.

Best guess: pilot induced a stall on the turn inbound to 9R

RIP - very sad.


* KMLB-Feb-29-2012-Cirrus-Crash.mp3 (1529.19 KB - downloaded 4156 times.)
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MikeNYC
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« Reply #2 on: February 29, 2012, 10:41:50 PM »

I just listened to it myself as well. My guess is N544SR. Seems to be based at MLB, does a lot of flights in and out of there whereas the others aren't. A good friend is an SR-22 pilot in Central FL and this certainly had me concerned for him as no news outlets were identifying POB or the tail #. Very sad.
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dave
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« Reply #3 on: February 29, 2012, 10:47:04 PM »

I should have checked al the other N5*4SR tail numbers.  I was checking another registry (an outdated Cirrus one) and should have just cycled through all the possibilities.  His initial check-in with Melbourne Tower was sort of muffled.

Thanks for checking this out...on the ground the tail number was unrecognizable, apparently due to fire damage.

My thoughts go out to all the families involved...a very sad day.
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Dngnkeeper
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« Reply #4 on: March 01, 2012, 09:37:18 AM »

Above link not working

Here is a video http://www.wesh.com/video/30575325/detail.html
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Dngnkeeper
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« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2012, 09:15:38 AM »

Further information ...

http://www.wesh.com/video/30585336/detail.html
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Fred_Garvin
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« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2012, 03:35:06 PM »

The way I understand this is there are 2 aircraft on final and 4SR is on downwind
Tower tells 4SR to extend his downwind and after a conversation about landing long
Tower tells him that is approved then says "cleared to land."

Should Tower have also said you are number 3 to land?

Either way it seems 4SR felt his extended downwind was no longer required.
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ShadowGod
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« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2012, 09:25:26 PM »

Seems to me tower controller clearly with the majority of the fault here. I'm a low time, not current private pilot who hasn't flown in 20 years but if you are "cleared to land" by atc does that not mean you can turn from downwind to base?

And the controller certainly should not have hurried him to make a quick tight turn to final and he should not have attempted it if he was uncomfortable.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2012, 09:27:24 PM by ShadowGod » Logged
ridejumpfly
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« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2012, 10:56:21 PM »

Can anyone fill in the blank? 

Twr: ok thats better ok then 4sa 4srr need ________ runway 9r and cleared to land.


I have listened to it a bunch of times and cant make it out.  Doesn't sound good for the controller.
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cgpawn
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« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2012, 09:17:51 AM »

pretty sure he said long landing is approved runway 09r clear to land
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bn2av8r
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« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2012, 09:54:38 AM »


I think "Chopper Dan" needs a remedial class on aerodynamics!  Hard to believe with a statement like that he is a pilot.
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ridejumpfly
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« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2012, 10:43:20 AM »


I think "Chopper Dan" needs a remedial class on aerodynamics!  Hard to believe with a statement like that he is a pilot.

No kidding, I thought the same thing!  Engine stalled...  really?
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flyflyfly
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« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2012, 01:58:23 PM »

No kidding, I thought the same thing!  Engine stalled...  really?

Hopefully a slip of the tongue only, and he thought "stalled the aircraft" when he said "stalled the engine" instead.
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TAPONE
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« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2012, 02:32:41 PM »

It is clear that the controller was momentarily confused between 7ER on a mile and 4SR, which caused confusion then to the pilot in 4SR.   Although the controller approved a long landing to 4SR, he did not clear him to land, but neither did he give 4SR sequence.  Hence the confusion.  4SR ended his "approved for long landing" comm with "cleared to land" and the controller did not correct him.  The controller actually asks 4SR if he had the Cirrus on a mile final (I am not sure of 7ER type), but the only Cirrus I heard in the comm was 4SR. 

Extremely unfortunate---and a good example of how critical clear comm is at all times and that readbacks - are there for confirmation, and must be treated as such.

May God put his hand upon the families of those killed and the controller to help ease their pain.

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Fred_Garvin
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« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2012, 02:38:33 PM »

I believe 1 Delta Alpha was also a Crirrus
7 Echo Romeo was a 172
« Last Edit: March 03, 2012, 02:41:30 PM by Fred_Garvin » Logged
ridejumpfly
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« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2012, 06:38:31 PM »

It is clear that the controller was momentarily confused between 7ER on a mile and 4SR, which caused confusion then to the pilot in 4SR.   Although the controller approved a long landing to 4SR, he did not clear him to land, but neither did he give 4SR sequence.  Hence the confusion.  4SR ended his "approved for long landing" comm with "cleared to land" and the controller did not correct him.  The controller actually asks 4SR if he had the Cirrus on a mile final (I am not sure of 7ER type), but the only Cirrus I heard in the comm was 4SR. 


I am 99% sure that the controller does say "[(long landing approved) this part was barely intelligible] and 9R cleared to land."  There was a SR22 (1DA) on final based on the earlier transmissions.  7ER was on final for 9L behind arrow 23T, 7ER was the Cessna ATC would have had to extend 4SR 6 miles to follow if he was to land 9L.   

My best guess is that ATC was glad to accommodate the long landing since 9R helped them both but failed to mention 1DA.  Possibly in his mind he thought he did tell him to extend but due to high workload did not. You can hear in the transmissions that he was starting to struggle.  I say this because of a few duplicate instructions showing he was not recalling if he had given certain instructions.

 


 
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joseph88190
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« Reply #16 on: March 04, 2012, 02:58:53 PM »

Student pilot from MLB here...
What I think the problem here at MLB is probably the controller overload...
MLB has average 366 flight a day, but because of how runways are designed, crosswind component can easily goes up to 15+kts, and GA flights has to be cancelled. Therefore most people fly as much as they can during fine days.
As far as I know, the controller who is on duty during the accident has the longest duty time. I can hear his voice almost every time I fly, and he usually do ground frequency at the same time. Because of that, he sometimes forgot or mistaken aircrafts' position.
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