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| | |-+  AAY emergency landing. KSFB
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Author Topic: AAY emergency landing. KSFB  (Read 32466 times)
Studentpilo
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« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2007, 05:47:20 PM »

Seaplane is a complete moron. I have no idea what that man was thinking when he made those transmissions. When ATC tells you something YOU DO IT. I don't care if its inconvenient, if it does not risk safety on your flight, you do it even if you don't understand it. Seaplane needs ground work on radio etiquette big time.
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corny357
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« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2007, 06:11:18 PM »

This seaplane guy pissed me off so badly that I found who he was.  If anyone else wants his phone number to have a word, just PM me.  I'm sure I'm not allowed to post it publicly here. 

Want to know the sad part?  He's got an ATP with type ratings on the 737 and DC-9.  Obviously retired airline captain.  Maybe they need to extend the retirement age from 60 to something higher, but certainly not for this guy.

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KSYR-pjr
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« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2007, 09:07:42 PM »

When ATC tells you something YOU DO IT. I don't care if its inconvenient, if it does not risk safety on your flight, you do it even if you don't understand it. Seaplane needs ground work on radio etiquette big time.

Ummm, not so fast.  Trust, but verify.  Controllers have been known to make mistakes that sent aircraft into mountains, other aircraft, or into the teeth of thunderstorm cells.  If a pilot does not understand an instruction, he/she is obligated to request clarification.   

In no way am I defending the pilot of this clip.  Instead, my point is that we pilots have an obligation to fully understand a controller's instruction to be absolutely sure it fits into our situational awareness of the flight.  A pilot who blindly or mechanically follows a controller's instruction is potentially setting him/herself up for a very bad day.   

 
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Regards, Peter
ATC Feed:  Syracuse (KSYR), NY
KSYR-pjr
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« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2007, 09:11:31 PM »

This seaplane guy pissed me off so badly that I found who he was.  If anyone else wants his phone number to have a word, just PM me.  I'm sure I'm not allowed to post it publicly here. 

Relax.  While this certainly was not general aviation's finest hour, there is nothing to be gained by embarrassing this pilot. 
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Regards, Peter
ATC Feed:  Syracuse (KSYR), NY
Biff
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« Reply #19 on: March 30, 2007, 09:28:26 PM »

It's not hard to find who's the owner of that airplane.  It doesn't mean he was the one flying it that day.

But yea, whoever he was, he embarrassed himself enough.  No one got hurt.  No need to go vigilante on him. 
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Miyridian
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« Reply #20 on: March 30, 2007, 10:39:46 PM »


Ummm, not so fast.  Trust, but verify.  Controllers have been known to make mistakes that sent aircraft into mountains, other aircraft, or into the teeth of thunderstorm cells.  If a pilot does not understand an instruction, he/she is obligated to request clarification.   


Did the controller not specify that there was an emergency in progress? That would tell me all that I needed to know.
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KSYR-pjr
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« Reply #21 on: March 30, 2007, 11:00:35 PM »

Did the controller not specify that there was an emergency in progress? That would tell me all that I needed to know.

Again, I repeat:  My comments were NOT a defense for the pilot in the clip.  I was responding to Student Pilot's specific words in his post that stated, "When ATC tells you something YOU DO IT... even if you do not understand it."



 
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Regards, Peter
ATC Feed:  Syracuse (KSYR), NY
Miyridian
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« Reply #22 on: March 30, 2007, 11:03:26 PM »

Understood and agreed. Sorry about the confusion.
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Studentpilo
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« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2007, 11:09:09 PM »

Did the controller not specify that there was an emergency in progress? That would tell me all that I needed to know.

Again, I repeat:  My comments were NOT a defense for the pilot in the clip.  I was responding to Student Pilot's specific words in his post that stated, "When ATC tells you something YOU DO IT... even if you do not understand it."



 

I should have been more specific. If there is an emergency on freq and ATC specifically tells you he needs to do something for that emergency, you do it. Emergency aircraft come first no matter what/
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KSYR-pjr
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« Reply #24 on: March 30, 2007, 11:36:24 PM »

I should have been more specific. If there is an emergency on freq and ATC specifically tells you he needs to do something for that emergency, you do it. Emergency aircraft come first no matter what/

Yep, in this particular case you are completely correct.   The controller made it extremely clear to the dolt of a pilot that there was an emergency IN PROGRESS.  After his diversion, the pilot makes the asinine comment that HE didn't see how HIS aircraft would have interfered with the emergency in progress, as if this goof had an air traffic radar on board his little Maule that depicted all aircraft around him.

In listening to that clip I picked up that the emergency aircraft was landing TO THE EAST and already called one go-around that resulted in a runway heading/maintain 2,000 feet altitude instruction straight out to the east.  If you look at Biff's sectional image he posted earlier in this topic, you will see that a runway heading go-around on runway 9 Left a second time would have placed the emergency aircraft right into the path of the Maule had the Maule been allowed to cut through the inner ring of the class C just to the east of the airport.  As controllers are not fortune tellers and couldn't predict a successful landing on the second attempt, they kept all options open by ensuring nothing else was in the airspace to the east of the airport.

So perhaps it turned out that the emergency aircraft did land and that the "sterile" airspace requirement exceeded the emergency by a minute or so (note the sarcasm here).  For a paltry $2.50 (see this cost of the pilot's diversion calculated earlier) the Maule pilot got to make a complete a$$ out of himself over public airways and suffer even more ego bruising right here in this board. 



 

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Regards, Peter
ATC Feed:  Syracuse (KSYR), NY
rubymountian
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« Reply #25 on: March 31, 2007, 01:39:35 AM »

OMG that seaplane pilot was an A$$ im half tempted to look up his address on the faa aircraft registration and send him a letter.  and a copy of his audio clip.  there was an emergancy in progress he should just do as hes told. and get out of the airspace. ugg.
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Check Airman
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« Reply #26 on: March 31, 2007, 03:04:43 AM »

Bravo Zulu to that controller for maintaining prefessional composure in that most annoying situation.
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KASWspotter
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« Reply #27 on: March 31, 2007, 11:11:59 AM »

Wow. He was crying about wasting his fuel. How about the time of the controllers he wasted during that emergency. I'm smart enough to know that if there is an emergency in progress you limit non essential communications. This guy needs a kick in the butt.
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XJETJUNKIE
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« Reply #28 on: March 31, 2007, 04:22:56 PM »

This just angers me to no point.  When an emergency is declared you do as your told and ask no questions unless it has to do with safety.  This guy should lose his right to fly!
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Dr Bob
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« Reply #29 on: March 31, 2007, 05:27:03 PM »

As PIC he can say unable if he thinks any irection form ATC will put HIM in jeopardy. Short of that you do what they say.

He is a seaplane....why didn't he just land in the water (he was over the lake) and wait it out....then fly as he wants. tongue
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