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Author Topic: EagleFlight 3040 bad stuck mic conversation  (Read 37804 times)
medflight5
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« on: September 18, 2013, 12:43:02 AM »

*Warning - language* Overheard on Potomac Approach (final) - 9/13/13. Silence and irrelevant comms removed.
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SirIsaac726
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« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2013, 03:55:27 AM »

"EGF3040, cleared visual approach runway 33L, contact Tower 119.4, HAVE A GREAT DAY."

« Last Edit: September 18, 2013, 03:57:19 AM by SirIsaac726 » Logged
RonR
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« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2013, 12:15:49 PM »

Somehow I don't think those pilots recognized the sarcasm  cheesy

I would have loved to overhear that telephone call  grin
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flyflyfly
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« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2013, 04:10:37 PM »

Wahaha! "Perfect" moment for the radio button to get stuck. cheesy

Funny to hear the really pi**ed off controller calling eagle flight once the microphone unstuck - and the pilot's clueless and innocent replies...

Have a greaaaat day...  grin
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jdflyer
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« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2013, 07:55:46 PM »

Do you think they intend to write this guy up on some violation over this incident?  What was he really guilty of?  Yeah there was some salty language broadcast but I think it is clearly unintended.  That is the nature of a stuck mic situation.  It seems more like the controller hassling him because of what he said.
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flyflyfly
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« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2013, 02:21:28 AM »

Sure, unintentional and the pilot hasn't violated anything - so I can't see him facing any consequences.

Still, the controller certainly didn't want to miss this opportunity to chat a bit about the "worst controllers of the country - they literally fly you into the ground without thinking twice" comment  grin. And it's good to settle such things offline. Assuming they are both good professionals, the controller probably reassured the pilot that safety is their #1 priority, the pilot apologized for his stupid comment - and that was that.

Hilariously funny nevertheless.  smiley
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RonR
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« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2013, 10:56:07 AM »

I'm fairly sure that those pilots weren't talking about the Potomac controllers (I hope anyway).  The conversation they were having almost certainly started before the mic got stuck open.  At least that's what it seems like to me.
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swa4678
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« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2013, 11:54:11 AM »

Do you think they intend to write this guy up on some violation over this incident?
I think they didn't have a choice - it's ATC's responsibility to do so.

FAA order JO 7210.3X says:

Quote
The air traffic manager is responsible for taking action to detect, prevent, and report:

a. Obscene, indecent, or profane language used on any means of communications (e.g., voice frequencies, Satellite Communication(s) (SATCOM), Controller Pilot Data Link Communications (CPDLC)).

What was he really guilty of?
Probably the violation of a federal regulation or two. Remember; the FCC rules the airwaves, and it has rules against things like Obscene, Indecent and Profane Broadcasts.
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flyflyfly
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« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2013, 03:07:50 PM »

I'm fairly sure that those pilots weren't talking about the Potomac controllers (I hope anyway).
Good point. We don't really know. Felt to me like at least the controller took it personally. And if the pilot had said something like "Potomac controllers are really great, the best I know. Those yesterday in the capital of Elbonia are the *click* worst controllers..." then the unlucky twist of things would be even more hilarious evil.

FAA order JO 7210.3X says:
Well yes. But that's obviously meant for intentional disturbances on the frequency. I still can't see any consequences for something that was undoubtedly unintentional.
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InterpreDemon
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« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2013, 03:40:17 PM »

He could have been intentionally making it look unintentional...  grin

I used to love how Phil Hendri would interview himself in the form of outrageous phone "guests" from his stable of about a hundred oddball voice characters... Vernon Dosier, Bobby Doolie, et al, using his characters to say all the politically incorrect things while he appeared to be the rational one. It was always amazing how many people thought it was real and call in to argue with his "guest". Some great entertainment in those archives.
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klkm
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« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2013, 03:01:58 AM »

Do you think they intend to write this guy up on some violation over this incident?
I think they didn't have a choice - it's ATC's responsibility to do so.

FAA order JO 7210.3X says:

Quote
The air traffic manager is responsible for taking action to detect, prevent, and report:

a. Obscene, indecent, or profane language used on any means of communications (e.g., voice frequencies, Satellite Communication(s) (SATCOM), Controller Pilot Data Link Communications (CPDLC)).

What was he really guilty of?
Probably the violation of a federal regulation or two. Remember; the FCC rules the airwaves, and it has rules against things like Obscene, Indecent and Profane Broadcasts.

The air traffic manager is not the controller, we as controllers are not responsible for writing up any pilot.  We may if we choose so report offenses to management who's responsibility it is to take action.  Otherwise, profanity on the lines, frequencies or any other method are never discovered, unless management is doing a random audit of said conversations.  Or you post it on this site....or they bash controllers while on a hot mic...
« Last Edit: September 20, 2013, 03:05:42 AM by klkm » Logged
svoynick
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« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2013, 06:47:32 AM »

FAA order JO 7210.3X says:

Quote
The air traffic manager is responsible for taking action to detect, prevent, and report:

a. Obscene, indecent, or profane language used on any means of communications (e.g., voice frequencies, Satellite Communication(s) (SATCOM), Controller Pilot Data Link Communications (CPDLC)).

What was he really guilty of?
Probably the violation of a federal regulation or two. Remember; the FCC rules the airwaves, and it has rules against things like Obscene, Indecent and Profane Broadcasts.
You may be right on the FAA order, but you are completely misinterpreting the FCC link you noted.  That is specifically about public broadcasting, i.e. AM/FM broadcast radio and broadcast television.  

Two way communications for business, private, amateur, aviation, public services, etc. are handled under completely different sections of the FCC regulations than public broadcasting.  (Analogous to aviation, where GA is under Part 91, but commercial carriers fall under completely different parts.)  

Not to say that there might not be regs on profanity under those different services, but just pointing out that the reference you posted is not at all applicable to aviation communications.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2013, 06:49:55 AM by svoynick » Logged
Shiffcl300
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« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2013, 12:36:16 AM »

Who exactly/what inner management facility would these pilots be calling? I hear the controller giving the crew a number to call starting with 540. That area code is in my area of the Shenandoah Valley. I'm just curious as to what offices or more likely individual they'd be speaking with? There is a designated FAA pilot examiner that lives in the area. Would that be a person of interest? Just curious about how this works. Thankfully never had to encounter such an ordeal.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2013, 12:39:01 AM by Shiffcl300 » Logged
notaperfectpilot
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« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2013, 08:42:25 AM »

Who exactly/what inner management facility would these pilots be calling? I hear the controller giving the crew a number to call starting with 540. That area code is in my area of the Shenandoah Valley. I'm just curious as to what offices or more likely individual they'd be speaking with? There is a designated FAA pilot examiner that lives in the area. Would that be a person of interest? Just curious about how this works. Thankfully never had to encounter such an ordeal.

I'm assuming that given that they were talking to Potomac Approach, that the controller were in the Potomac TRACON room. The FAA says that it is located in Warrenton, VA, with that same 540 area code for contact. I also have that same area code, so at first I thought it a little strange, but if you look at a map of the coverage of the 540 area code, it covers a lot of area. They are probably still in the area code. Most likely the phone number rang right to the controller himself...
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klkm
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« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2013, 02:43:51 AM »

The number given is typically the OMIC (Operations Manager In-Charge), they man the desk in charge of the whole facility at any given time.  They are Area Managers who rotate through.  The supervisor (FLM), will fill them in on what happened, and they will typically just discuss what happened, how to avoid it in the future, and gather any other information.  The controller rarely actually talks to the pilots who are told to call.  If needed the controller will have filled out a statement, for a pilot deviation or incident, this way the OMIC has the controllers side of the story.  At a tower it will likely just go to the supervisor. 
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