Author Topic: Newbie has some questions  (Read 8892 times)

Offline Ilanious

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Newbie has some questions
« on: March 05, 2008, 11:10:27 PM »
 :?

Hey whatsup my name's ilan.  I listen occasionally.  Always boggles my mind how the NY approach guys handle stuff, they never stop gibbering.

My question is what is an "A Ron?"  or sounds like "A Ron" anyway.  I was listening as my United430 made it's way from Denver to Newark and the ATC approach guy said something that sounded like that.

Also I guess another question is as to why they say something like "proceed to 17,000 feet, altimeter reading 2964."  What's with the 2964??  this was also on the approach.

It's funny y'kno, these guys do the same things over and over again but goddamn if u get it wrong it could be tits up.

thanks for the help

ilan



Offline jdfmoc

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2008, 01:27:41 AM »
First off welcome,

The new york airspace is tight and those controllers are remarkable. ARON could be a fix in the NY airspace if you can give more of a detailed statment. Altimeter 2964 is simply the altimeter setting measuring the atmospheric pressure. A wrong altimeter setting could be the difference in life or death. Numerous accidents have been faulted on wrong altimeter setting. Hope this helps some.

Offline NY Z Pilot

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2008, 08:26:32 AM »
NY TRACON really is amazing. Its the busiest TRACON in the country. Ive been there 3 times before, its like you walk into a different world. Not sure what ARON is all about, im almost 100% sure that its not a fix...could be wrong.

Offline Jason

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2008, 08:35:04 AM »
NY TRACON really is amazing. Its the busiest TRACON in the country. Ive been there 3 times before, its like you walk into a different world. Not sure what ARON is all about, im almost 100% sure that its not a fix...could be wrong.

AYRON is the outer marker for the ILS 22L (pronounced "eeh-ron").  N90 really is amazing as you mentioned.  When I had the opportunity to plug in with some of the guys, I realized how the facility really is different than any other in the world from an operations standpoint
« Last Edit: March 06, 2008, 08:36:42 AM by Jason »

Offline tyketto

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2008, 02:03:57 PM »
And to go into further detail with the altimeter/QNH setting, each body governing the airspace around  the world (the FAA in the US, CAA in Canada, etc.) as well as other aviation bodies have designated a transition level between gauging height based on the local altimeter QNH setting, and height using the standard setting in thousands of feet (IIRC, only Russia uses meters for this; everywhere else uses feet). In the US, that transition level is 18000ft., based on the standard altimeter setting of 29.92 inches of mercury (QNH is used everywhere else outside north america, which standard is set to 1013. easiest way to convert between the two is 'altimeter setting / 2.954 = QNH'). So when descending out of FL180 (18000ft) to a lower altitude, the local altimeter setting for the destination airport, or closest weather reporting airport in the vicinity of the descent must be given. In your case of UAL430 flying from DEN to EWR, the controller may have said something like:

"United 430, descend and maintain one seven thousand, Newark altimeter two niner six four."

This is assuming the approach controller gave the pilots the Newark altimeter. That comes from the METAR report for that airport or reporting station.

BL.

Offline Ilanious

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2008, 06:32:43 PM »
heh y'kno those stories of people walking into new york city subway train yards and driving them away like it's their job?

sounds like some of u could do the same..

Offline Ilanious

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2008, 06:40:02 PM »
Oh sweet so I guess a for more q's:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_Landing_System

Dude that guy in the tracon boy he just did not stop, wow, amazing, really. 

Do they ever give tours of these placeS?  I doubt it especially since 9/11, SUCKS!! it would be wicked to check it out.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2008, 06:45:41 PM by Ilanious »

Offline Jason

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2008, 06:48:17 PM »
Oh sweet so I guess a for more q's:

What is "ILS" mean?  The 22L is runway 22 left.

Dude that guy in the tracon boy he just did not stop, wow, amazing, really. 

Do they ever give tours of these placeS?  I doubt it especially since 9/11, SUCKS!! it would be wicked to check it out.

ILS is the acronym for "Instrument Landing System" which allows aircraft to follow both vertical and lateral navigation equipment to complete an instrument approach procedure at an airport.  You will find a wealth of information by typing any of these terms into google or wikipedia.

They do offer tours of the facilities which allow them, but you really need to have a few facility contacts to get inside.  I've visited the NY TRACON (N90) three times but had the qualifications and management contacts at the facility to allow them.

Best,

Offline tyketto

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2008, 07:06:42 PM »
Oh sweet so I guess a for more q's:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_Landing_System

Dude that guy in the tracon boy he just did not stop, wow, amazing, really. 

Do they ever give tours of these placeS?  I doubt it especially since 9/11, SUCKS!! it would be wicked to check it out.

They still do give tours. Some places say that they don't or won't, but with Operation Raincheck, they can. It truly depends on the facility.

about a year or so ago, I and a couple others here toured NorCal Approach here in Sacramento, and it was pretty sweet. All of the sectors had their own 'spoke' around the TMU and weather center at the 'hub' of a wheel. needless to say, the screens and what they had were really cool.

We also toured SMF Tower, which was really nice. If you give the facility a call, and give them a good amount of lead time (2 weeks should be enough), they should be more than happy to accomodate a small tour.

BL.

Offline Ilanious

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2008, 08:35:07 PM »
what does it mean when they plane says they're "heavy"


Offline tyketto

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Re: Newbie has some questions
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2008, 08:54:50 PM »
what does it mean when they plane says they're "heavy"



It means that the particular plane's MTOW (Maximum Take Off Weight) is greater than 255,000lbs. B757-200s are exactly at that limit, but are not called heavy, though they are treated as such (exceptions are ATA's B752s, which they were configured to exceed the weight limit). Other aircraft that are heavy are B757-300s, all B767s, B747s, B777, A300, A310, A330, A340, MD10, MD11, DC10, etc. the A380 is currently in its own class, but its proper MTOW is still being decided.

Additionally, spacing between a heavy and non-heavy aircraft, as well as between heavy and heavy aircraft are greater compared to spacing between non-heavy aircraft, because of wake turbulence.

BL.